People say 'Yes' to this? - Page 5

**Ivramire** · 10-26-2009, 11:23 PM

Originally Posted by Jikanu

Did you see the purely factual part of my comment? Developed countries dont have such a huge population issue; women's empowerment in countries in India can help massively. Also, i forget the name, but there was a country that had one of the world's highest populations, and started a huge birth control campaign that lowered it to the point where it was sustainable again... As for your prevention assertion, wouldnt TRUE prevention be keeping them from getting pregnant in the first place?

The key part of the first section of your assertion is the word ''developed'' i.e. already having the resources, framework, structure and ethos to have mitigated these problems or don't have them at all. The crux is that the problem is set in the ''developing'' nations i.e. those without the means or even necessarily the will to affect true change. Working to change conditions on-the-ground is well and good, but the difficulty is in the here-and-now. Implementing changes such as the ones prescribed will take time, it's not easy to change what may be engrained in another culture's societal or cultural norms.

While you're working on gradually changing things, the unwanted pregnancies that you're trying to prevent are still going-on. When it comes down to it, what can you really do to stop a woman from having an abortion? Outlaw it in your nation and they go to where they can have it done. It's lack may very well lead to a surge in 'underground' practices hidden from the eyes of the state and thus most unsafe. What could you do with a woman who wanted to have an abortion, against the moral values of everyone else but her own? Force her to carry the baby to term?

Jikanu · 10-26-2009, 11:24 PM

Ivra:

Originally Posted by Jikanu

@Hrae: I think the main population issue could be solved through sex ed and empowering women in nations such as India. in places like China, it's a bit different, though. But abortion isnt really the best solution, due to it being considered unethical, immoral, and the fact that it's only really viable in majorly developed countries where population isnt a huge issue.

India's considered "Developing" still.

Abortion isnt really effective in reducing population.

If that's not what you meant, let me point out another part of my statement you quoted:

Originally Posted by Jikanu

Did you see the purely factual part of my comment? Developed countries dont have such a huge population issue; women's empowerment in countries in India can help massively. Also, i forget the name, but there was a country that had one of the world's highest populations, and started a huge birth control campaign that lowered it to the point where it was sustainable again... As for your prevention assertion, wouldnt TRUE prevention be keeping them from getting pregnant in the first place?

**Ivramire** · 10-26-2009, 11:35 PM

Originally Posted by Jikanu

Ivra:

India's considered "Developing" still.

Abortion isnt really effective in reducing population.

If that's not what you meant, let me point out another part of my statement you quoted:

I'm not really sure why you put-in the italicized parts. I know that India's developing still, that's why I mentioned the developed/developing parts before.

I've actually seen some documentaries on this subject. Not abortion per se but population in developed vs. developing countries. The stuff they're trying to do in India is very interesting. Distribution of condoms, sex-education etc. Funny part is some women said their men didn't want to use the condoms, haha...

Jikanu · 10-26-2009, 11:37 PM

Which is why women empowerment is so important, once again... letting them make choices instead of being treated like baby machines.

**Hraesvelg** · 10-26-2009, 11:59 PM

You say "empowering" women like it's something that can be done by fiat. Hell, look at hard it is to convince someone like you that they might be wrong.

**Hessah** · 10-27-2009, 12:04 AM

I just read an article yesterday, something about a 13 year old in England is going to be a proud Dad-to-be with his 14 year old girlfriend...

It also went on to list England had their youngest dad at 12 last year, and another 14 year old girl was pregnant and two 15 year old boys came out to claim that they're the father...

And then there was another case in India, where a 19 year old got his 17 year old step sister (i think it was) pregnant, and they tried to abort it by drugs, that didn't work and they end up having a deformed daughter who needs full time care (at the time of the documentary that I saw, she was already 7 years old)...

I agree that education would be important to reduce the number of unwanted pregnancies, but it doesn't stop it from happening in developed or developing countries.

**Phantom Badger** · 10-27-2009, 12:11 AM

^ Yeah, I heard about the England cases too.
I also know for a fact a girl in my class lost her virginity at age 12...
Infact a few girls have alreayd los ttheir virginity in my classes. The ones I know about were with guys like 2~3 years older than them =/

**Hessah** · 10-27-2009, 12:18 AM

I'm sure it doesn't only happen in England, but he article just happen to be about cases in England.

Does that mean we have to start showing them condoms at like 8 or 10? I guess the problem is they wouldn't go out and buy one and that's probably where they become parents...

**Leesa** · 10-27-2009, 12:45 AM

Well children are "learning" about sex younger and younger with each generation... So who knows we might just have to.

About abortions... I'm not fully against it. I think that most people who think that abortions are "wrong", it would be because its a human child, and people naturally tend to think that humans dominate and are better than any other living being. When really, aren't you eating babies for breakfast everyday? Aren't billions of babies being sold in stores? They don't have to be human babies, they're still eggs, chicken babies, but people just don't seem to care, because people have gotten over it and think its a matter of survival (most, anyways)

I think if you know that a child isn't going to be raised with a happy life, either its because you know you aren't ready, or whatever reason... I say just get an abortion. I don't know if the baby feels any pain but if you're getting one that means its probably not as much pain that the child will feel later on in its life.

Now if its just about "Uhmm....Yeah I don't feel like having a baby..." then, well it would still be better since that means you know that you wouldn't raise it correctly, but that means that persons an ass.

**Hraesvelg** · 10-27-2009, 01:10 AM

Originally Posted by Leesa

Well children are "learning" about sex younger and younger with each generation... So who knows we might just have to.

That's not quite true. Not too far in the past it wasn't uncommon for a woman to be married off by 15.